302 1/2 Bail

[piscesman]

Not my area of expertise but what year and version would the serial # A02019 be? Checking for someone. Thanks
Kim

[Sandman]

Hey Kim, they don’t get much earlier than that serial number. I’ve only seen a few earlier. First version, late 1953. Half bail 302s were only made to about serial number A03500. Photos would be great.

Sandman

[cshannon772]

Hi Kim,
I agree with Sandman; very early First Version from 1953 and quite hard to find in any condition. I have A01120 and A01381.
Kind Regards,
Chris

[piscesman]

Hey, you 2, thanks for the reply. The reel is not mine and will see if the owner will send me some pictures. I didn't know if the 1st version had serial numbers or not.
Kim

[Sandman]

Kim, all first versions I’ve seen had serial numbers. I’ve never seen a 302 without a SN and I’ve never seen a SN below Chris’ A01120. I’ve always wondered if the first 1000 were non-serial numbered pilot reels…just never seen one.

Sandman.

[piscesman]

Thanks again for the reply's. The 1st 1,000 as test reels does make sense. Sooner or later one will probably pop up. Who knows, it may be different in design which Mitchell had to modify for usage.
Kim

[Sandman]

Kim, below are the only reels I've recorded with lower SNs than the A02019 you are looking at, so not many. As Chris states, these are scarce reels. Several below are in Randy, Chris' and my collections. I've recorded a couple in the A036xx range and those are the highest SN half-bails I've seen.

There were a number of characteristics that changed up to about A35000 at which point the changes slowed. I have most of those characteristics and timeline changes recorded, but have no idea what went on with the first 1000 reels.

Sandman

A01110
A01120
A01193
A01381
A01439
A01709
A01761
A01877
A01968

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[piscesman]

Beautiful pictures sandman. Just realized they came with spring handle. Can't imagine reeling in a big one and handle starts to twist from the excitement.
Kim

[GreatLaker]

Sandman,
Quick question: I noticed that there is no thumb/finger flip button like the Mitchell 300 1/2 bail reels have and am curious as to whether this one is missing or did the 302 model not come with one?
Kind Regards,
Bill

[Sandman]

Hey Bill, it actually does have a thumb-flip for the bail. A better photo below. It even has the serrated edge like the early 300, 304, 306 trip levers.

Thanks Bill, actually, its a screw down counterweight on the crank handle. Just doesn't have the knurling for grip. The knurling came when SNs transitioned from "A" to "B" series, around 1956. About 100,000 reels. They must of initially placed an order for 100,000 smooth counterweights.

I did a study on the early variations of handles for these reels and it was posted in the previous forum. There are four main versions of these handles. Glad to share again if anyone is interested. Note the lack of exaggerated shoulder on the crank handle base on this one. Extremely rare to find these. Only came on half bails, as when they transitioned to full bails they soon realized the bail would hit the handle on about every fifth revolution, so they quickly added a larger shoulder to get the handle away from the bail.

Sandman

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[stickboyette]

I have one of the earlier ones with the unique handle. How many of these early half-bails had the "big foot"? I also have the original box but unfortunately the G.I. that brought this reel back to the USA covered it in drab olive duct tape, inside and out!

[piscesman]

Not sure as to how many. Some people here have serial numbers on them. According to Dennis's Value Guide " Big Foot" was the second version 1952/53. It was a special-order " custom " reel that fit a specific rod. Could be purchased without the elongated foot. I would imagine a fraction of the standard size foot. Nice reel.
Kim

[Sandman]

Stick boy, very nice half bail…and yes it has the early and rare crank handle. What is the serial number on the back plate? I’ll check my records on the production of the big foot.

Sandman

[Sandman]

Stick, I checked my records and every half bail I've recorded below A03182 is a long foot. I've only recorded 12 below that number, (they are one of the most rare Mitchells to find now) but again everyone of those has been a long foot. So, I'm not convinced it was a special order option on the early Half-bails, at least not until I find a short foot reel in that serial range. Mind you, the back plate can be changed so we must look at various characteristics to be sure. I'd say with relative confidence your reel has a spanner axle nut (non-hex) and screws that hold the oscillation slide to the axle (vs clips). More photos would be great, particularly of the inside of the rotating head (there were several trip mechanism changes in this period), and a photo with the back plate off.

I would say your reel has a serial number somewhere between A01000 and A01700, but Mitchell has fooled us before.

You have an exceptional reel in much better condition than most of these you'll see. Congratulations! While the internals held up very well under heavy salt use, the exteriors not so much.

BTW, your box may be in poor condition, but it would be the first box I've seen of a 302 half bail. I don't know of any collectors with one. Photos of it would be great too...especially of the insert.

Sandman

[stickboyette]

Hi Sandman, Thanks for the info! This reel is buried in a pile of boxes but I will get it out soon. The pix that I have presently are from the old sticksreelworld.com website and back in 1999 "hi-res photo" meant 640x480, LOL. So that's why we can't read the doggone serial# from the picture. I do remember it having internal parts similar to what were posted earlier in this thread (especially the non-hex nut).

From what I can tell, the box looks like other early full-bailed Salt Waters that I have in my possession. It is taped EVERYWHERE, inside and out! I have considered ways to get that tape off but never had the guts to try. I don't remember receiving any of the paperwork with the reel and box. This is the only half-bail Salt Water still in my possession. I sold a few others off about 20 yrs ago. I think one went to Wallace Carney if my memory serves me right.

Stay tuned... give me several days to find that reel! Here are the other two pix from the old website. The mark on the top of the spool is interesting...

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[Sandman]

Sounds good Stick. Those marks on top of the spool I would assume to be casting marks of some sort. They are indicative of early spools. Most of my early 302s have them, up to A35xxx.

Sandman

[stickboyette]

Alright, found the 302 halfbail. My serial# is A01747. It's a big foot that was filed down a bit. The parts seem to line up with Sandman's. I've also included pix of the box that was covered with Olive Drab tape a long time ago by the original owner, a serviceman that picked up the reel originally in France. Looks a lot like the style of box we're familiar with from the early 50's Salt Water reels. Do you see any difference in the structure or hole shapes/positions?

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[stickboyette]

More pix

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[stickboyette]

The box:

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[Sandman]

Stick, thank you for the photos. As suspected, your reel is an early one. It is the seventh earliest I've seen and it came off the line 38 reels after mine. It is identical to mine in all aspects. Only item I can't verify if it has screws instead of "C" clips that hold the oscillation slide to the axle, but I'm sure it does. I also cant tell if the handle has no shoulder where it screws into the main gear, but being that it has no slot or knurling on the counterweight, I'm sure it is one of the very early and rare no-shoulder crank handles. It also helps to tell us that half bails were made with a big foot, foot.

The box seems to have the same hole pattern as my earliest Salt Water box (A19913 - photo below), but its tough to tell anything more than that...seems like it could be the original box. if so, it's the only one I've seen, in any condition.

Very nice condition. I've ever seen a half bail Salt Water that didn't have a filed foot. They were only sold in France for a very short period. Verrrrrry rare reel.

Sandman

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[stickboyette]

Hi Sandman,

I've attached a handle picture. Besides the obvious half-bail, the handle is the most amazing thing about this reel. Whatever material they used should have been used on later models because it has remained shiny and beautiful over 70 yrs! I had never seen another HB at the time and wondered if the handle was incorrect, from some other reel.... until I saw my 2nd early HB.

Nice Garcia label! I have a few different label versions on various 302s. I think at one time I had more than 100 of the Salt Water and 302 reels, but only two of the half bails. The 302 addiction was due to the fact that I fished a 302MP as a kid, LOL. Then many years later, eBAY came along and I bought a few nice ones. Then I started noticing differences and bought more and more, trying to document all the various versions. Yep, a typical "manic collector" story.

Somewhere around here is an early full-bail 302, possibly a bigfoot, in box with the original Mitchell logo wrapping paper around it. I won it on eBAY about 20yrs ago, listed as "Sealed Wrapped Never Opened Mitchell Salt Water." Of course when it arrived, the Mitchell wrapping paper fell right off it because the thing had been carefully unwrapped some time previously. I paid dearly for that reel and beat up (figuratively speaking) the seller afterward to get a little discount. Anyway, where I'm headed with this story: I'll find that reel/box and take a few photos. It's the closest I have to an early 50's Salt Water time capsule.... wish the seal had not been broken.

- Stick

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[Sandman]

Stick, thanks for the handle photo. That is the early no-shoulder handle. I know what you mean about it being shiny. mine is too. The later handles has some sort of coating or anodizing that made them more of a flat sheen. There were three different yellow Garcia stickers used on these reels. The first, right after the half-bails was arched. the one in the photo above is the second sticker.

Owning two Salt Water half-bails is extraordinary.

Would be great to see photos of your time capsule.

Sandman

[GreatLaker]

Sandman & Stickboyette,
What a fantastic post. I really enjoyed this post and it even has a happy ending. As always I learned many new things about the 302 1/2 bail. I would also like to mention that the photography between the two of you is truly spectacular! Wish I could get those great close-up shots to come out as well.
Thanks to all.
Kind Regards,
Bill

[stickboyette]

You bet! Thanks! It's amazing how good the iPhone cameras are. I use an iPhone11 now as it is so easy to take a picture, crop/adjust it on the phone, and send.

My old Sticksreelworld.com website was shot using a circa 1998 Olympus digital camera at a hi-res setting of 640x480, and I used to have to pull the memory card out, insert it in a special reader attached to my computer, and then edit with a program I had to actually pay for!

- Stick

[piscesman]

TOTALLY agree about the picture quality................
Kim