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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:53 am • #  
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I am showing you a copy I have of Volume 1, No. 1 of The Charles Garcia Spin Fisherman Quarterly. Just try and find that one! This one was published in the fall of 1951. Here is where we see the ad for the introduction of the right hand wind Mitchell on the back page. (anyone have suggestions as to how I can get pictures on here from my computer folders?) Dan


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:41 am • #  
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Hello then good to hear from you again. The pictures that you want to upload here have to be no bigger than 700 by 700 pixels. There's a way to reformat them on computers but depends which one you have. Then at the bottom of the screen you will see choose file and click on that. You can only upload one picture at a time but can post several pictures on the same message. Good Luck.
Kim :sCh_fisherman:


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:41 am • #  
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Dan and Kim,

I believe 850 pixels is the current size limit (height & width). I've resized my images to that and they have uploaded/attached here just fine.

There is a limit of 3 images per post.

John


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:50 pm • #  
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Mates,

Per Dan's request, I am posting Dan's images he referred to at the start of this thread.

John

Quote:
I am showing you a copy I have of Volume 1, No. 1 of The Charles Garcia Spin Fisherman Quarterly. Just try and find that one! This one was published in the fall of 1951. Here is where we see the ad for the introduction of the right hand wind Mitchell on the back page. (anyone have suggestions as to how I can get pictures on here from my computer folders?) Dan


Attachment:
51 SpinFisherman Vol1No1 cover Mitchell records.jpg


Attachment:
51 SpinFisherman Vol1No1 backcover Mitchell lefthand.jpg


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:12 am • #  
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Thank you, John for your help. I have some other very interesting document pages, probably the earliest known, for the Mitchell reels as they came from Charles Garcia at the beginning. I hope these early documents are of interest to readers. I plan on revealing these within the next 2 weeks. Dan


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:25 pm • #  
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As one would expect, the information which Dan has provided fits very well with what is available in the UK.
The attached page from the 1951 J.B.Walker catalogue shows only LHW available at that time, and suggests that the Mitchell is a relatively new product.
The Carp Catchers Club rotary letter has been published in book form. The attached are extracts from letters from Ingham and Walker in February and May 1952. RHW is not yet available in the UK, but probably imminent.
Richard Walker was the leading UK angler of his generation and dominated the UK angling scene for over 30 years. He smashed the UK Carp record in September 1952 while using a claw-bail reel with a MK.4 Carp rod which he designed and hand-built himself. This capture really helped put Mitchell on the map over here.
I have seen a French catalogue from 1951 which tells us that RHW was in the course of preparation at that time.
I found a RHW reel without serial number. It had the usual features of an early reel : bulbous line guide, steel cover plate screws, flat bottomed spool, first type of baffle plate. This reel has been restored ready for use and converted to crosswind by its' new owner and can be seen in the Questions to MRM section under the topic "RHW Mitchell question".
I look forward with interest to further information on early reels and Garcia from Dan.
Rolands.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 7:03 pm • #  
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Nice INFO. Quick question here. The 1951 Garcia AD tells about the left-Handed reel. Does it mean the 1/2 BAIL or the FULL BAIL?????
Kim :sCh_fisherman:


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:59 pm • #  
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Hi Kim, I guess that is for the readers to search out and discover. I only presented what I found. Dan


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:04 am • #  
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Perhaps the attached will help. I have seen a similar document in French.

Rolands.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:35 am • #  
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Mates,
I'm 98% sure I once had a left-handed half bail, several years ago, but there's that 2% not sure.

Regards,
Ted Lanham


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:29 pm • #  
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Mates, attached is info related to LHW Mitchell and one on the bay right now...do not know serial number of the one on the bay...

Sandman


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:50 pm • #  
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I never checked the pictures here when last posted. I have in a red box the "left handed half bail reel" with upside down writing in my basement. Just have to locate and post here. I remember it's used but still in nice shape. Rain in forecast so more time to locate...........
Kim :sCh_fisherman:


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:09 am • #  
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Some serious digging through my addiction I located the reel with the Box.
Kim :sCh_fisherman: :sAni_fish:


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:11 am • #  
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Here are two other pictures. Bottom of the box marked Fair Traded and serial number.
Kim :sCh_fisherman: :tup

Question here. Should I have an aluminum spool holder or did plastic come out around then? The spool in the plastic container has the skinny looks like Roman numeral two.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:04 pm • #  
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Dear Sandman,
I think the book extract you have pictured is from Dennis Roberts' excellent value guide; a book I really like.
The information Dan has given us suggests that DR was a little early with his dating of the RHW. I don't know if you noticed but DR inadvertently describes the reel as Left Hand Wind : a mistake I've also made.

Dear Piscesman,
That is an outstanding collectable. Very hard to find in that condition and with a box I should think.
The cut-out in the box tray is shaped to take a plastic spool container; so everything looks correct. Lovely !!

Rolands.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 4:31 pm • #  
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OK, now onto the 2nd set of early Charles Garcia documents. I found these in an early Mitchell box-the blue one with the alligator hide-like covering. I think these were probably the earliest Charles Garcia instructions and parts and price lists that came with the reels. They are so old that they are coming apart at the seams where they were folded neatly in the box. It is a wonder they are still together. I am keeping them well protected in plastic protectors. On the backside of each document it appears to me, that the reel instructions and price lists were hand typed. That would have to be a very early effort on the part of Charles Garcia at the beginning. Notice on the first document that the form was preprinted with Charles Garcia as the importer. Also notice that the form was printed in France. Does this raise questions in your mind? The 2nd form is shown in a couple of Wallace's books, but this will be the first time the back side is shown-also typewritten. I am sure Charles Garcia also did that. OK you guys, digest and discuss or refute to your hearts content!! Dan. Hopefully, I can download these to this site. If not, John has offered to help.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:08 pm • #  
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Mates, Here are pics of my 3rd Version Left Hand with inverted writing. It has serial number A08103. I understand that the Left Hand versions came out when the serial numbers were started in 1949/50 at the start of mass production according to the "Mitchell" by Wallace Carney. Note that the serial number is white --- I've noticed this on early Right Hand Version 3's also. The Made in France is very small compared to the other 3rd versions I have, I assume that the die was new. :-) Randy


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:15 pm • #  
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Mates,

Per Dan's request, I am posting Dan's images he referred to above in this thread as his 2nd set of early Charles Garcia documents.

Below is part one.

John

Attachment:
Mitchell France by Charles Garcia 1.jpg

Attachment:
Mitchell France by Charles Garcia 2.jpg


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:18 pm • #  
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Mates,

Here is part two of Dan's 2nd set of early Charles Garcia documents.

John

Attachment:
Mitchell Moulinet spare parts 1.jpg

Attachment:
Mitchell Moulinet spare parts 2.jpg


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:04 pm • #  
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J Fishkat,
Those are awesome documents that you posted for fishhawks, and big thanks for doing that.
Until now, I never realized that the early models had a half bail made of a stainless alloy.
I've been through several of the half bail reels with the boomerang a/r and many had lost all the chrome plating with just brass showing, so I had to check the one "2nd" model to see if there was any indication of pitting. Wow, it does look to be some kind of a stainless alloy.
All of the 3rd models I have are near mint, but still you can tell that they are plated.
Question 1: Are there any 3rd models with stainless bails, or did Mitchell drop them with the other changes made going from 2nd to 3rd?
Question 2: That one paper says that a manual pickup was an option, but has anyone seen a factory manual pickup.
Thanks John and fishawks again for these documents.

Regards,
Ted Lanham


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:30 pm • #  
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Ted and Mates,

May I say, I am enomorously grateful to Dan for his ORCA forum post way back in 2009 on Garcia catalogs/annuals, which helped me sequence what I had and informed me what else had been published. I only echo what others have said about Dan's contribution to Mitchell knowledge; it is substantial. It's wonderful to see Dan back blogging and in this forum. My role in helping Dan to post is really minor.

Ted, In regard to your question about stainless steel alloy, please see 1953 Charles Garcia Catalog item 1. (below). I present this only to further discussion; I make no claim about an actual reel (which I await learning about with you).

Warm regards,
John

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Garcia 1953 Catalog pg002-3.jpg


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:40 am • #  
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Fascinating paperwork Dan and Fishkat.
I recently purchased a mint MK.2 reel from a French collector which came with the same owner's leaflet printed in French; photo attached. This leaflet has a reel bag in place of Garcia's details and it has no printing on the back.
The reel it came with is what I would class as a mid-period MK.2 in the early tall box with plain blue lid.
We can now be fairly sure that Garcia did start by offering the MK.2 reel.
I was looking through some boxes the other day and I noticed that none of the early boxes I have with Mitchell bottom right and a plain blue lid have the "Fair traded" stamp on the bottom. I have 3 "Alligator" boxes and 2 are stamped "FT".
Have any members seen the early plain blue box stamped "Fair traded" ?
Does anyone know for sure when boxes were first stamped? Mike diMattio suggests 1947, I think.
I'm surprised about the claw -bail being steel. I will check my reels later, but I am sure I have wooden handled reels with brass grinning through the thin chrome plating. I'm fairly sure I have a MK.1 with all of the chrome missing and what is underneath is brass.

Rolands.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:45 am • #  
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Mates,

Sorry. I incorrectly added "steel". The paperwork only states "stainless alloy".

John


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:12 am • #  
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Mates,
I'm afraid that this ads have more questions to our "lists of questions".
I checked the red knob cross-wind 3rd version I have, and it's pickup chrome is, almost, completely gone. Not stainless.
"Tailor-made reels", makes me scratch my head, but for a $274 reel (Inflation) you should get what you want. Even a roller winder.

Regards,
Ted Lanham


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:19 am • #  
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On reading this debate, I have the impression that it was Garcia who made the Mitchell reels.
Just my understanding of all these long "technical" phases through my automatic translator, so my non participation in this debate, I let the specialists Garcia debate between them.
Best regards,
Christian


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:24 pm • #  
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Mates,
I just noticed that in the 1st of Dan's second set of pics, that the says that the a/r knob is optional. The pic calls it an "optional pawl". Has anybody ever seen a "Mitchell" without a anti reverse?
Some of this makes me think that these guys went to the same advertising school as the people that, even today, have pictures of the really cheap new automobile on their full page ad, and when you go to buy it, they don't have one. :sCh_taz:

Regards,
Ted Lanham


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:45 pm • #  
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Dear Ted,
I suspect that optional simply means that it can be turned on and off.
I have checked through my early reels and they all have chromed brass claw bails.

Dear Christian,
I don't think anyone thinks that Mitchell reels were manufactured by Garcia.
It is just a few new collectors making their own research into the early days.
I'm sure I speak for all members when I say that I am always interested in what you have to say on the subject of Mitchell reels.

Kind regards,

Rolands.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:09 pm • #  
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Ted, I asked myself the same question about the optional pawl several years ago. As I studied into this question, I came to the conclusion that the word "optional" was referring to giving the fisherman the option of using an anti-reverse option, or not using it, when fishing. Also, and perhaps I am wrong, I have thought that anti-reverse features were not available until after WW II. I have studied other French made spinning reels and haven't discovered any, to this point, that had a AR feature, prior to WW II. But I am not closed minded on this topic.

Also, referring back to my first posting for the Spin Fisherman Issue, The date of publication was October 30, 1951.

Again, I want to thank John Fishkat for his help in posting these documents, otherwise they would never be available for everyone to see and consider. So I do not consider his help as a minor role. Thank you very much, John.

I have other equally interesting information or documents that I am thinking of posting in the future.
Dan


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:13 pm • #  
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Tinca,
That would be a new definition of the word "optional" for me, but could be.
I suspect that Liondor may have been using a little sarcasm with his remark.
I'm sure there's 100% agreement with you about valuing Liondor's input.
Since other's have not found any stainless alloy, I am going for another round of examining my 2nd version.
Any more remarks about manual bail?

Regards,
Ted Lanham


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:22 pm • #  
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Hello Rolands and all the mates,
Garcia, I am novice on this subject: to know if a sticker was black on a white background or the reverse, I have no use for these debates.
The tropics are now all focused on Garcia and his documents, a tropic on a Mitchell from his country of origin encounters no reaction, the population of this site is of English-speaking and often off the Atlantic, so it's normal That we do not have the same references to Mitchell.
So I'll go to sleep waiting to find an "interesting" topic for all, I feel too isolated on this site.
Best regards to all
Christian


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